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Author Topic: Why Honda Why?  (Read 4323 times)

Offline Mick

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Why Honda Why?
« on: July 22, 2017, 12:58:10 PM »
Noticed Honda has changed the wheel bearings on the IZY.  They have gone from a pretty decent ball bearing arrangement (Front wheels on SP machines), (All wheels on Push machines)  To a really crappy cheap plastic hollowed out bushing, and these things collapse if you breath on them.

I have to ask why, especially when you can get better wheel bearings as standard on some £100 machines. 

You can see in the image below what happens, because they are hollowed out the middles break away, and then the wheel is running on two very thin plastic discs. 




Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2017, 04:09:29 PM »
Yep- I bought an Izy based on recommendations on other users that I know. Unfortunately Honda appear to have changed a few things compared to the slightly older machines that these other users have:
Wheel bearings are really cheap and nasty plastic bushes, not bearings. Both rear wheels lasted only a few months, and front going the same way. Honda dealer claimed that machine had been "user damaged" by bumping down steps (which is impossible anyway, due to the rear rubber blade fixing), and that Honda would probably not repair under warranty!
Paint quality and thickness on deck is rubbish. Corrosion starts, especially on welded areas, within a few months.
Only decent thing on the mower is the engine, which you can get on many other mowers.
It seems that the new Izy is a very low cost model only to tempt users into buying Honda, instead of cheaper makes.
I will not be buying another Honda..

Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2017, 04:31:06 PM »
Mick- do you know where I can source relatively low cost metal ball type bearings to fit the HRG416PK (push) wheels?

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2017, 04:56:21 PM »
Hi Harvz, and welcome to TGMF

I'll be honest and say I haven't actually got around to measuring the bore size in those wheels. I should imaging they will be of a size which would take proper bearings, but like I said I've not investigated this yet, they look pretty big though.  I have one sitting there waiting for new bushes now, so in the morning I'll have a measure up and report back.

Why the heck they designed it like this is beyond me, they are seriously rubbish for such an expensive mower. 

There's a couple of other things that irritate me about these machines, one being the handles, the always flair out at the bottoms and then won't locate securely.

And on the latest engines those three studs that hold the tank and recoil, always come out with the nuts, and the hex is now hidden in the plastic cowl so you can't get hold of it.

The power of dreams my ar$e. lol..

Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2017, 06:41:15 PM »
I "think" that the bearings might be 1/2" inner bore by 1+1/8" outer, but don't have calipers here to measure exact.

Lol- the handles were ticking me off too, so I simply put a little force into bending the flaired bottoms back inwards slightly. They now locate securely, but the thumb screws need to be undone a bit more than previously to get the handle folded. The whole folding mechanism seems quite cheap, compared to other folding handles that I have.

Haven't had a problem with the tank/recoil studs-yet..

I do however have an occasional backfire issue- I know the cause is carbon buildup on the spark plug. Cleaning it stops the backfire for a while. Question is what might be causing the build up? I haven't adjusted throttle settings since new. Cleaned the air filter- no change. I stripped down and cleaned the carb (it was quite clean anyway). On re-assembly, I had a slight issue getting the auto choke to carb mechanism to go together right. I think I have it right- the choke pivot should push the carb mechanism- is that right? Can I send a photo for you to check, if you are able to advise?

Cheers


Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2017, 08:20:34 PM »
We get a few of these suffering from the backfire problem, only on startup, some more or less straight out of the box to be honest. 

The choke is pretty straight forward, as long as long as you get all the gaskets, choke control plate etc in the right order and the right way around it should be ok.  That said I hate auto chokes with a passion.  There's been a couple of variants to this choke system over the last few years since the system came out.

Feel free to attach a photo to check this out. 

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2017, 01:44:41 PM »
Going back to the wheel bearings. I had a couple of old IZY wheels from a earlier model kicking around, and tried the bearings out of one of these and they fit as a replacement for the new bushes.  So it looks like Honda have simply swapped the ball bearing for these ultra cheap quality plastic bushes.  ???

Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #7 on: August 06, 2017, 08:18:27 AM »
Cheers Mick- that's what I thought. Do you happen to know the bearing sizes, or a suitable part number?

Was cleaning down the underside of my Izy deck yesterday (in order to paint over yet more areas of surface rust with Hammerite). Forgot that there was another stupid thing about this mower- the grass exhaust part of the deck has a really stupid inward facing flange. All that this does is prevent a smooth flow of grass into the collecting bag.

Again just poor design by Honda.

By the way, the Smooth Hammerite paint seems to do the job. Areas previously painted show no new signs of corrosion. Quite funny really, since I initially went to the local Honda dealer, and asked them to quote for paint to match the deck colour. They didn't have anything, and said that they had never been asked in the past. Yeh-right! This is the same dealer who told me that Honda hadn't changed the wheel bearing design!

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2017, 08:49:55 AM »

Cheers Mick- that's what I thought. Do you happen to know the bearing sizes, or a suitable part number?


Part number is 91051-VE0-750 Also listed on amazon, but you might find some cheaper elsewhere https://www.amazon.co.uk/Honda-Genuine-91051-VE0-750-Front-Bearing/dp/B005A4N80U

Listed as a front wheel bearing, but will replace anything using these new black plastic bushes.  ;)

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2017, 07:34:34 PM »
Had another IZY Push come back today, was only 10 days old, and both rear wheels had fallen off completely.  Failed crappy bushes again.  I found some Steel ball bearings from a old IZY and fitted those.  Customer wasn't happy, but is now.  ;)

Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2017, 09:31:13 PM »
I have bought 4 new steel wheel bearings, fitted them to the rear wheels, and what a difference!  Both rear wheels, which were basically falling off, are now stable, and rotate free and better than when brand new.
Basically Honda have used cheap plastic bushes, that are only suitable for kids toys. Disgraceful that they think that they can get away with their prices, whilst making the mowers cheaper and poorer.
Let's see what their customer service is like-I am going to try sending an invoice to Honda UK for the cost of the bearings, since the mower is still within the warranty period.

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2017, 11:02:23 PM »
Harvz, glad you got that sorted.  Much better isn't it. ;)

They will have to rethink this one surely, a recall would be the decent thing to do..  Let me know how you get on with your complaint to Honda.


Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2017, 07:55:15 PM »
Another thing that I am disappointed in the quality on the new Izy.
The plastic retainer which is supposed to hold the engine end of the control cable. It has two fold back flaps, but when folding the handle there is pressure put onto this retainer to pop out of the metal flange. Already one of the plastic flaps had broken off, meaning that the assembly operation is now only relying on one half holding. Compared to previous Izy mowers, this is just a cheap assembly, and is just more evidence of a mower more typical of items made in China.

Offline Mick

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2017, 09:02:14 PM »
Another thing that I am disappointed in the quality on the new Izy.
The plastic retainer which is supposed to hold the engine end of the control cable. It has two fold back flaps, but when folding the handle there is pressure put onto this retainer to pop out of the metal flange. Already one of the plastic flaps had broken off, meaning that the assembly operation is now only relying on one half holding. Compared to previous Izy mowers, this is just a cheap assembly, and is just more evidence of a mower more typical of items made in China.

Harvz, got to admit the only time I've seen that particular problem is when the cable is routed incorrectly, your OPC cable is probably hooked under the L/H handwheel (the one you undo to fold the handles.  If it is it shouldn't be and needs to be re-routed over the top of it.

Most of the mowers out there use this type of fixing nowadays TBH, and they also use them for the clutch cables too, which can make them a bit tricky to replace when you can't get in there to squeeze those lugs to remove the damn cable from the gearbox.  Mountfield, Honda, Hayter and many more use the same system.  Your IZY probably has the same click in cable end at the top as well, you'll see what I mean when you have to replace that cable.

Very, very easy to fit, but a absolute Ba$---d to remove.  ;)

Offline Harvz

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Re: Why Honda Why?
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2017, 11:02:54 AM »
Thanks for the reply Mick. Any idea where I can but the plastic fixing on its own, or would I have to buy a complete OPC cable assembly?

Also, underneath the Izy deck, the front has a welded piece with a very annoying thin air gap. This is a grass sticking point, and I am tempted to fill it up (don't know what with right now) and smooth it out. However I don't know whether that gap needs to be there for airflow or something. Any idea whether this is the case?